Trayvon Martin

[JAK]

When I was growing up Canadians tended to always vote for the same party, but you couldn't tell the difference between them, and you would never really know who they voted for unless you asked them. People still had different opinions, on any number of issues, but that was more or less independant of how they voted, just as it was of what church they went to. Now things are so damned polarized, still not as much as in the United States, but we're getting there. People now assume that if you vote Conservative, than you have that party's stance on everything, and if you vote Liberal, than its the opposite, and if you vote NDP, well I don't know much about them because we don't really have them in New Brunswick.

Anyhow, Canadian's are not supposed to be so damned polarized. Pick your hockey team, pick your car maker, pick your church, vote for some damn fool or another, but don't make a big deal about it. You still have to live with the same guy next door no matter who wins the stanley cup. That's the way it is up here, and that's the way it should remain.

[Ralph]

Don't be misled by headlines, in most of the US calm prevails. The most polarized folks, and by far the nastiest, are the loonier specimens of the left and they get the publicity.

[GJZ]

When I was growing up Canadians tended to always vote for the same party, but you couldn't tell the difference between them, and you would never really know who they voted for unless you asked them. People still had different opinions, on any number of issues, but that was more or less independant of how they voted, just as it was of what church they went to. Now things are so damned polarized, still not as much as in the United States, but we're getting there. People now assume that if you vote Conservative, than you have that party's stance on everything, and if you vote Liberal, than its the opposite, and if you vote NDP, well I don't know much about them because we don't really have them in New Brunswick.

Anyhow, Canadian's are not supposed to be so damned polarized. Pick your hockey team, pick your car maker, pick your church, vote for some damn fool or another, but don't make a big deal about it. You still have to live with the same guy next door no matter who wins the stanley cup. That's the way it is up here, and that's the way it should remain.

I agree, here in America if you dislike obama everyone is quick to assume you are racist or a Bush fan. I dislike the entire administration and race has NOTHING to do with it. Although I would take Bush over obama in a second I would also take Herman Cain over obama even quicker. I did not vote for Bush in the last election because I didn't like either choice on both sides. Voting party-lines can be a big mistake for a country or a state. And the liberal democrats of today are 180 degrees opposite of the Conservative democrats from years ago. But there is one BIG difference - when a Republican votes for a person that turns out to be a bad choice the Republican will admit the person is doing wrong....democrats on the other hand live in denial and won't admit when they are wrong, make a bad choice or mistake. And the media slants the truth and sides with the democrats 9 outof 10 times.

[one-eyed Bob]

Those people who identify themselves as members of the "Tea Party" are 50% Republican with the rest being Democrat and Independant. Many people are upset with the way the media, and leftists both in politics and in education, have taken over the political process.

[GJZ]

Many people are upset with the way the media, and leftists both in politics and in education, have taken over the political process.

I agree, Maybe it's because the media and leftist keep getting caught slanting the truth over and over again.

But it is the people's fault for letting them....

[GJZ]

FWIW, The topic of this thread is the "BIG STORY" on CNN tonight.

The "BIG STORY" where they are talking about all the UNKNOWN facts.

Anyone think of this scenario?

What if Zimmerman was at the point of excessive force on the ground and unconscious by a person who was 6'3."
(not the 12 year old as shown in the picture by the media).

Zimmerman with a legal firearm that could have been used against him after he was unconscious?

The last thing a person would want is their own firearm to be used on themselves....

Another thought;

Does a person's attire have an influence on the way they are veiwed?

Why is there a dress code in Junior High that prevents a young person from looking like they out on the town late at night on the wrong side of town?

Can the way you dress or the vehicle you drive be a reflection of your character?

Isn't it human nature to be attracked or detracted to another individual?

And in court isn't it common for the Judge to instruct a person to use their common sense, logic and experiences in life based on the FACTS to determine a verdict?

It is actually against the law to use your feelings or "empathy" to determine a verdict.

But if a lawyer says "who polices the police?" in the vicinity of Los Angeles CA you know what the verdict might be....
(An area where there is a high conflict between criminals and the police....an area where a "hoodie" might "fit" a certain profile)
This is pay back time for those who live among the criminals and don't want others to be accountable for their own actions.
Not saying this is right or wrong. I'm saying this is a fact.

So, If Zimmerman had a legal Right to be protective of his neighborhood and there were a series of recent break-ins would he not be allowed to be suspicious and protective of his own community as a neighborhood watch person? And protect himself IF he was attacked???

To find the truth there needs to be a LOT of questions asked on both sides of the fence.

But this is a FACT: The media DID slant the truth and edit the audio tape....

Now the truth starts to come out and the networks said they made a mistake?
(seems to be a common mistake made by the liberal media)

Isn't the liberal bias media the real trouble-makers and racist in this incident?

The liberal media is more worried about distorting the facts then gathering and reporting the truth.

Who holds the media accountable?

The same media who supports the democrats by slanting the truth.

YOU can hold the media accountable when you vote against the democrats they support....

The last thing anyone should do is reward them with a second term if they didn't do what's best for their country.

This adminstration didn't have top play the race card.
This administration is the race card. They use it more than anyone.

obama made statements against "the bitter people in PA who cling to their guns and THEIR religion.
obama sided against the Christians, Jewish and Catholics the Constituion and America.

obama threatened/scared the senior citizens with their tax-returns last year.

Whose side is he on?????????

We know obama/this administration won't place any blame on criminals, gangs or illegals?

It is truely unfortunate it wasn't Herman Cain instead of HUSSEIN obama, biden, holder and pelosi four years ago.

I honestly believe McCain wasn't the best choice we could have but things wouldn't be so out-of-control as they are with the obama administration.
I honestly believe Herman Cain on a bad day would have done ten times better than obama on a good day.
obama did a LOT of damage in his the last four years.

This administration caused more problems and spent more money $$$ with NOTHING to show for it than any other in American history.

This administration has NOTHING to run on except a failed health care bill, failed operation fast & furious, acorn and solyndra scam.

obama and his wife has taken a LOT of vacations though....

Is this what you want another four years of ???

If you are not working to protect America, then YOU are working to destroy it.

[Bedlam]

Don't be misled by headlines, in most of the US calm prevails. The most polarized folks, and by far the nastiest, are the loonier specimens of the left and they get the publicity.

Come on now Ralph, what about the extreme right? Believe me, I'm no bleeding heart liberal (all extremism is dangerous IMO), but there are just as many right wing extremists as there are left wingers.

Ryan

[robcollins]

Come on now Ralph, what about the extreme right? Believe me, I'm no bleeding heart liberal (all extremism is dangerous IMO), but there are just as many right wing extremists as there are left wingers.

Ryan

Thank you. Another point that seems to be lost is how extremists from either side of the spectrum, left or right, tend to resemble each other. My case in point: Hitler, Stalin. I had no idea how far this thread would go when I started it, it was intended to be advice in humility and leaving ego at home for ccw carriers, which is why it went into the "firearms" folder originally.

Imagine my surprise that this thread turned to left vs right...

1. I'm pro gun (Rifle & shotgun merit badge @ age 13, busted 23 of 25, ccw permit holder, handgun hunter, like to build AKs for fun, don't reload centerfire, yet...)
2. pro life
3. love GOD (but not as I should)
4. and try to love my fellow man
5. have close to a year's worth of food in my basement
guess which side of the fence I'm on and why....

I think based on the info I've seen, (and I'll quickly acknowledge the media bias) Mr. Zimmerman REALLY screwed up. Doesn't matter if the kid was 8' tall and wearing a ninja suit. The fact that he was on the PHONE when this started pretty well says he wasn't vandalizing or stealing stuff, quite frankly, I don't know how big he was, being followed, in the dark, is grounds for having my hand wrapped around something with the safety brushed off. But not for Trayvon, he was a kid. Which trumps coon, punk, non-resident, hell, even non-American illegal alien. I base that feeling, not on my political leaning, but rather on numbers 2-4 above. If you're (choose one: a. Christian, b. Jewish, c. Muslim, d. Hindu, e. Buddhist) and feel, even a little bit, that KID possibly got what he had coming to him, I'd suggest you've got some reading to do. For choices a-c, I've got good suggestions of what book, for d & e, for some reason, I feel you might not feel he was deserving, but, you probably won't read this site anyway.... Too bad for you, there's some great stuff...

[JAK]

My own feeling also, without much fact, is that Zimmerman screwed up big time, but is not a racist. I really don't think the Feds should be able to intervene in his case. I do think racism might have something to do with how the investigations was interfered with, as I believe it was. I think it had alot more to do with politics than racism, but I think racism played a role in people allowing politics to interfere with justice.

I don't like the way Zimmerman is being villified, by the press or anyone else. The outrage should be focused on the police chief and the state attorneys that appear to have messed up, and interfered, and in my opinion continue to interfere and cover up. I don't think the Feds will be able to interfere much, because the racism angle is pretty weak. Hopefully they will interefere just enough to have a second set of eyes on the case, and that should help get the truth out.

I think the press should cover this case, but cover it differently. Lay out the letter of the law, and what the normal process is, and the history of similar cases, and when the Feds can get involved and to what extent. They could also do a better job of showing not just similar cases that have gone bad, but also police departments and state prosecutors that have successfully cleaned things up, or are in the process of cleaning things up.

The press is as much of a mess as the police and justice and political systems. Self righteous hypocrites. The only proper news program in terms of how its presented is PBS News Hour, and not enough people watch it. The 24 hour news channels are the worst becuase they provide such a spectrum of crap that no one knows where the spectacle begins to end, and the news begins to start. This has a terrible influence on the general populations, making people more polarized and sensationalized, and less apt to reason things out for themselves.

[Ralph]

If, as seems to be the fact, Zimmerman was appointed by the homeowners assn. as part of the neighborhood watch he had every reason to watch - that is what a neighborhood watch does or am I missing something here?

"Zimmerman screwed up big time" is a declarative statement of opinion based on what? I would be happier if I had some sworn testimony and evidence to work with here BUT regardless of what the media and other idiots declare it is well to remember that the police rarely advertise an ongoing investigation so any declaration that "nothing" is being done is probably without merit.

"Come on now Ralph, what about the extreme right? Believe me, I'm no bleeding heart liberal (all extremism is dangerous IMO), but there are just as many right wing extremists as there are left wingers."

Why don't you name a "right-wing extremist and give me a quote that matches the nasty rhetoric of the looney left? On par with Maher saying that Sarah Palin's kid was knocked up, or mocking her youngest, disabled, child? Or wishing, and meaning it, that someone die as was done many times with Dick Cheney. Remember that Cheney is no longer in office and is unlikely to be running for office any time in the future.

"extremists from either side of the spectrum, left or right, tend to resemble each other. My case in point: Hitler, Stalin"

What in the world makes you think the two cited were at opposite ends of the political spectrum? There was very little practical difference between National Socialism and Communism - they certainly are NOT opposite each other.