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copper
11-02-2003, 04:40 AM
As I continue to save for a true lightweight rifle, I was really impressed with the fit and feel of the winchester trapper model in 30-30. A lever action with 16" barrel. In NY, my shots are sure to be considerably close range (mostly) and I do hunt in spots where the brush is pretty thick. Can I feel comfortable with this choice for the time being? Assuming good shot placement is there, would the 30-30 be sufficient for the Black bear of this region?

Thanks for the help.
Copper

Jim S
11-02-2003, 04:51 AM
I just bought a trapper in 45 colt. I haven't had a chance to use it yet but I do like the way it handles. I have a Marlin 336 in 30-30. It is a bit heavier than the trapper but it is easier to mount a scope. The 30-30 is plenty of gun for deer for 150 yards and under. It is not my first choice for bear (I like big holes in bear) but if the shot placement is good it will work. The biggest black bear I've seen killed was shot with a 30-30. Good luck.

Randy
11-02-2003, 05:32 AM
Copper,

I have the Trapper in 30-30 as well. A dream to carry, fun to shoot and load for. I grabbed mine yesterday for a little stroll in the woods here. Mostly because bear season is still open, chances of seeing a cougar are fair and the coyotes are running everywhere. I sometimes wonder about bears, but I also know that thousands have been taken by straight shooting folks long before the advent of hard hitting mags and big scopes. Enjoy /images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif

11-02-2003, 05:34 AM
Copper- You might want to chack out one of these:
http://www.marlinfirearms.com/firearms/1894_centerfireRifles/1894SS.htm
Also Marlin recently discontinued the model 1894p which is a 16.25" version of the same gun with blueing, not stainless.
Here's one I found quick:
http://www.gunsamerica.com/searches/P6UTp9jr-NoAAC7NLtQ-1.htm
I think the .44 would be a little better suited to most woods whitetail and black bear hunting here in New York. Look into Federal castcore 300 gr solids (.360 Meplat!!), 250 gr. Winchester Partitions, or some of Sundles Buffalo Bore fodder. I would call Tim and talk a little with him, as he has tons of experience with lever actions. Good luck.

Ken
11-02-2003, 05:39 AM
...uhhh I'm not sure how I wound up being curley??? Anyways, that last post was really me, Ken. Good luck copper.

copper
11-02-2003, 11:15 AM
Thanks, guys. There is nothing like this board for learning!!! .44? I never considered that caliber. I'll have to investigate how readily available that is in stores/reloading (my next project).

Ken
11-03-2003, 04:18 AM
Copper- another plus with the .44 is cost. Being a non-reloader at this time, $18 per box of 50 for the American Eagle by Federal makes for fairly cheap practice ammo.

Forster
11-03-2003, 01:22 PM
Copper - I have used a Winchester 30-30 on deer and hogs in Florida but never bear. My experience on hogs tells me it would probably work okay on eastern bears. Its a fine choice and with a nice light kick, but I agree with the guys here that the 44 mag is probably even better out of a lever gun and out to 125 yards. My brother and hunting buddy uses a Marlin 44 mag when the shots are close and his critters always wind up deader than mine /images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/laugh.gif Just kidding, but seriously there does seem to be alot more damage from the 44 mag then the 30-30, and things do proabably drop quicker as a result of the damage. Also, you can't go wrong with that Federal cast-core hunting ammo or you may want to call Sundles about some of his even heavier hitting 44 mag Buffalo Bore. I think someone on the board was talking about a 45 Long Colt lever gun with heavy ammo being about equal to a 45/70 and that sounds like alot of fun if you want to reload or get a hold of the custom stuff from Tim. The nice thing about the 44 mag and 45 colt are that you can shoot the same thing out of a strong handgun like a Ruger. By the way if you end up experimenting with heavy handgun loads out of a lever gun, the Marlin really is stronger then the Winchester; also you can expect your shoulder to take notice of the heavy loads. Sorry to make it more difficult but these things get me going. Cheers.

Phasmid
11-04-2003, 10:10 AM
There is M-94 .44 20" barrel right now for $220 on Gunsamerica.com The ad number is 976398843

Roger Beach
11-07-2003, 08:08 AM
Hey Copper,

I posted the info on the 45 Colt Trapper with handloads. I load 24.5 grns of H110 behind a 310 Keith SWC cast hard. The load data from Brian Pearce was 25 grains but my Lil Dandy measure drops 24.5 so I went with that.

I sighted in at 25 to get on the paper and it just put them all in a tight group with a receiver sight and gold bead. One ragged hole.

Then I moved to 100 yds and it shot under 3". The next day I couldn't hold them and it went to 4" but I'd had oral surgery and was pretty gun shy.
I have to learn to avoid those guys in hunting season.

The 45-70 Federal 300 grain load clocks at 1800 fps, so that 45 Trapper is one powerful carbine. I probably am getting 1550 to 1650 with a 16" barrel. I'll let you know when Cordell brings chrony out to the range.

Pearce chronographed his 25 grain load out of a 20" Winchester 94 at 1820 fps.

I have shot deer with a 4-5/8" Ruger Blackhawk and a 260 Keith and never recovered a bullet. The just sail through, so a 300 should do well on elk or pigs.

Good Hunting!

Roger