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Ralph
05-19-2006, 04:38 PM
If anyone is interested, Wiggy's is selling out their line of poncho liners for $17.50 ea.

Somewhat reluctantly, I just ordered a couple. Problem is, he doesn't include a lot of information with his listings, so I am assuming a lot.

Anyone have one of these? I assume he uses Lamilite insulation, but maybe not. I'd also like to know how small they stuff.

I'll find out when they are delivered, but any advance information is appreciated.

Mel
05-19-2006, 07:41 PM
Here you go Ralph: http://lightfighter.net/groupee/forums/a/tpc/f/2756008371/m/3141029822

Mel

Ralph
05-19-2006, 08:21 PM
It seems the consensus is: warmer than the issue liner but bulkier. Same length but not as wide. Heavier cover material than the issue liner, too. A lot of the guys intend to put it in the car/truck emergency kit, thinking it too bulky for packing. One guy opined that the green MOLLE bag would probably compress the same.

Everyone agreed that it was a good value for the price.

I'll let you know what I think when I get it.

Curious about the size. The poncho liner is supposed to be tied into the issue poncho, which would regulate the size of the liner.

I will likely install a zipper set as in the Ranger Ric kit. We'll see.

fireballxl5
05-19-2006, 11:17 PM
I got one.

Size is about 54" x 76"
My tape measure was not long enough so I measured half and doubled, so there may be an inch or two of "give" in the dimensions.

It's about 15"x4" rolled up fairly tightly.
You might lose an inch on rolled girth if you really wanted to roll it tight.

I think it would roll better than stuff, but a compression stuff sack, might make me a liar.

According to my kitchen scales weight is 2lb 2oz.

Yes they are Lamilite, but like real poncho liners they are sewn through, so cold spots are likley.

I've not slept under mine, but it's great sitting around the house.

I find mine quite stiff, ie it does not drape well, but I assume with a bit more washing that it will improve in this regard.

Still for $17.50USD I'm not bitching.

perrydog
05-23-2006, 11:53 AM
I bought one cuz it was on sale for cheap.....I am putting it under the seat of my boat for the wife to use when she gets cold. Should work well as it is washable, fairly warm and better than the blanket that is in there. It is pretty stiff and bulky which I was not expecting....I was think it would be a lightweight lamilite blanket that I could compact down better.

I can't really see the use as a poncho liner but it should work as an emergency blanket.YMMV.

-phil

Ralph
05-23-2006, 05:19 PM
The stiffness is likely due to the fabric used. Try running it through the washing machine once or twice with an old pair of sneakers. A lot of light fabrics are sized for ease of manufacture, and washing removes this. The sneakers pound it a little bit that should make the fabric more drapable.

The issue liners I have were new, and fairly stiff. I made a ripstop "envelope" to fold the liner into, rather than stuffing it. This measures about 4" x 4-1/2" by 15" - about the same size as the rolled up one mentioned by fireball.

perrydog
05-30-2006, 10:46 PM
I was goofing around thi afternoon and it will fit into a long pocket....barely. I rolled it and then stuffed it in,

I havent washed it yet to see if that helps with the stiffness.......

-phil

weekend warrior
05-31-2006, 12:32 PM
Here's a dumb question.....I picked up a pair of these and noticed there's no hole for your head.

I e-mailed wiggys and asked about this. The response was that these were copied from a Marine issue poncho liner (without a hole).

Do the marines really use a different poncho liner or are these folks smoking something? In the grand scheme of things I'll more than likely never use these for anything other than a lightweight throw. It kind of bugs me though that they aren't what I considered a "poncho liner".

Oh well....

Hanzo
05-31-2006, 01:46 PM
Weekend Warrior,

I've never had one that DID have a hole, issue or otherwise. As far as I know, you use it only when sleeping in the poncho, I wouldn't know because I never used mine. I would sometimes take my poncho if I was expecting rain in order to make an easy shelter, but for the most part, I just used a Goretex if I was worried about rain. I've never had much use for a poncho liner. They are bulkier than a sleeping bag and dont stay as warm. If I'm someplace where I'm willing to take the time to unpack a poncho liner and lay down and curl up, I've got enough time to take out my sleeping bag instead.

Ralph
05-31-2006, 06:01 PM
The original idea of the poncho liner is that they were supposed to be smaller and lighter than a sleeping bag as well as more general purpose. New insulations and methods have made some sleeping bags smaller, but the liners are still smaller and lighter than many bags.

None were made with head holes. Used as a blanket, just wrap it over your shoulders - Indian-style.

The Ranger Rick kit adds a zipper-closed head hole as well as a zipper around the outside.

My Wiggy's liners arrived today. They seem well-made and substantial, with fabric and insulation significantly heavier than the issue version. My impression is that they are a lot warmer than the issue liners, though this is not the best time to judge that as it is currently in the mid-90s here.

Just rolling it with my hands, it seems that 4" x 14" is about right. My initial impression is that this liner is a good buy. I think I will make an envelope-type bag with three compression straps similar to the bags I made for my issue liners.

With this type of bag you fold the liner into the bag rather than stuff it, then compress the diameter with the compression straps.

I also got a couple of 100" #5 double zippers. These are $10 ea from Outdoor Wilderness Fabrics.

Dan M
05-31-2006, 06:34 PM
No issue poncho liner I have ever had, had a headhole. It's just a "blankie".

Woods Walker
05-31-2006, 08:50 PM
Yea there is no hole for your head and lots of luck using it to line a poncho. This is standard on all and I don't know the reason why the term liner is used. But makes a nice blanket and you can sorta kinda add the poncho plus liner for a sorta waterproof blanket. I wonder if Wiggy is using his special insulation for the liner. I am going to buy one for 17.50 but I will have someone order it for me. Wiggy just hates my guts. Don't know why? I never insulted his gear. Only the way be interacts with people.

fireballxl5
06-01-2006, 12:13 AM
All that being said, on a US issue poncho liner I owned I unpicked 12-15" of seams (not sure if current issue liners have these seams) of the center where the two halves of the poncho liner meet and re-hemmed them, to use as a head hole.
A little bit of velcro finished the job for using the liner as a sleeping blanket.

This was pretty damn good tied into a poncho when sitting in the drivers hole of an M113 for mounted ambushes in the rain.
Warmth and (copmpartive) dryness.

At one stage I got a new crew comander (must a broke the previous one) and he arrvied before his bush gear, just before an exercise.
The system did not have any howard green jumpers (wolly pullys) in the Q store, so he borrowed that liner and used it in pncho fashion, along with a Coat, Mans, Field (pretty much an M-65) for his only insulation for the entire exercise and was happy enough - at least warmth wise.

BrooklynBen
06-01-2006, 08:16 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by fireballxl5:
This was pretty damn good tied into a poncho when sitting in the drivers hole of an M113 for mounted ambushes in the rain. </div></div>Do I correctly understand that you've been trained to stand on the drivers seat, with the lid open, ostensibly to fire your personal weapon for mounted ambushes??

Ralph
06-01-2006, 01:55 PM
The Wiggy liner does use Lamilite as insulation. As I said, it's a good buy for a utility/emergency blanket. It would have been better if he had used a nylon ripstop for the outer fabric instead of the heavier material. The label doesn't identify the material but it feels like a poly-cotton. The thread seems a good bit heavier than the issue version. I've seen a lot of issue liners begin to come apart as that light thread breaks.

I'll be tinkering with a compresion envelope in the next few days and will post what I end up with.

P.S. The material isn't as slippery as the issue stuff either. It does seem to be sized, so I'll run it through the washer to see if I can get it a bit more drapable.

fireballxl5
06-02-2006, 03:04 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by BrooklynBen:
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Originally posted by fireballxl5:
This was pretty damn good tied into a poncho when sitting in the drivers hole of an M113 for mounted ambushes in the rain. </div></div>Do I correctly understand that you've been trained to stand on the drivers seat, with the lid open, ostensibly to fire your personal weapon for mounted ambushes?? </div></div>No I was trained to sit on the driver's seat and be ready to either drive the vehicle or dismount and clear the enemy.

So unless things went tits up drivers would not fire their pers weapon unless clearing enemy.

duckear
06-02-2006, 11:24 AM
I think the term poncho "liner" was from Vietnam, where the liner was designed to mate with the poncho to form a sleeping bag for tropical conditions. I don't think it was ever intended to increase the warmth of a poncho while wearing the poncho.

Did they even have liners in WWII or Korea? I thought it was a Vietnam era development.

Ralph
06-02-2006, 12:10 PM
In 'Nam the only sleeping bag needed was the poncho and liner and it was introduced in the late '60s as I recall. And you are right, it was never intended to be worn as a poncho.

In typical GI style, it was used in a variety of ways once it was issued. As a blanket and as a bulk carrier for soft stuff, mostly. It's a useful piece of gear. The poncho, the liner and the no longer issued utility net are the "big three" of multipurpose personal gear.

In a combat environment, wrapping a blanket around you is preferred to zipping up a sleeping bag. Zippers jam at inoportune moments - like when suddenly attacked. With the wrap-around, you can keep your rifle with you and just stand up or roll out of the blanket - ready to rock &amp; roll.

BrooklynBen
06-03-2006, 06:52 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> fireballxl5:</div></div>Thanks. I'm actually glad to learn that I had misunderstood what you were saying. Thanks again.

fireballxl5
06-03-2006, 11:51 PM
Ben:
No probs.
We do things differently to you guys, so I thought it worth clarifying.

murphquake
06-05-2006, 09:43 PM
Got my pair of 3 color desert Wiggy-Woobies. Very nice, will supplement the light and heavy weight surplus ecotat sleeping bags I have... been using the heavy bag as a blanket all winter... again... it's just soo snuggly. One of the liners is in the bag it came in, stuffed in haphazardly and squeezed the air out, then tied up the bag, tossed it in the trunk. Honestly my first thought upon seeing the bags was if Wiggy can sell them for $17.50 he should market them in int'l orange with customizable lettering to EMS, SAR, Rescue and FDs... would make great casualty blankets. My biggest complaint about it is that it is narrower than I remember woobies being. I'd prefer something about half again as wide if I were going to fold it over for use as a makeshift sleepsack. But as I'm using it as a light blanket it's not too big an issue yet. It does hold it's shape a bit too much, not as much drape as my ecotat bags, but in this weather that's not bad (right now it's a 'turn the ac up to low ice age and get snuggly in the desert' sheet). All in all I'd say they're a great deal. A big orange one with some reflecty strips and a big EMS star of life would be pretty cool for ambulance use in places where you'd get that sort of thing back (in nyc it would last 1 tour... get used on a patient and never seen again or stolen by me and my partner and never seen again.
-bill