do you believe in jesus?

[oldschool]

this image was taken when my niece stayed with my wife and me there are no external lights on outside we are outside playing with glo stixs on strings at 11pm. are these angels or ghosts or?? (go to second post for picture)

[oldschool]

http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb100/oldschool13/home017.jpg

[Ksnake]

Nope just dust.

[oldschool]

ksnake I was once like you very skeptical. these things move things and I have many pictures besides this one..

[idaho lad]

I'm not a Christian, but I believe that Jesus existed and was God incarnate.

And no that cannot be The Lord Jesus Christ, Son of The Living God.

You see when Lord Jesus comes he come in a Revalation. Revelation means an unveiling. A true sight of just how brilliant and righteous he is. He comes again as The Lord Jesus Christ, and to be Exalted and take his rightful place as ruler and conquerer of all nations. Everyone will bow at the knee when he comes.

Why?

He is revealed, and not veiled in weak human flesh, but unleashed and open for all to see. Here is how we'll see him.

"Behold he cometh with clouds and every eye shall see Him. Even those which had pierced him. And all kindred of the Earth shall wail because of Him. Even so. Amen.

I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning, and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, which was, and which is to come, the Almighty."


You see the when Lord Jesus comes he comes with the Shekinah clouds of Glory. The clouds associated with the glory clouds of the Ark. It shows and magnifies Gods glory.

Also we are told that EVERY eye shall see him. Yes, every eye, and even the eyes of those who pierced him. So I would expect that there will be an tremdous awakening of those who had gone to the grave before us.

Then all nations of the earth will wail because of HIm.

Like I said, I am not a Christian, but I guarntee you this. When The Christ touches down on the Mount of Moriah and His feet hit the ground, it will be an Earth shaking event, and I promise you, you won't miss it or mistake it for anything else.

[BiggerStick47]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: oldschool</div><div class="ubbcode-body">ksnake I was once like you very skeptical. these things move things and I have many pictures besides this one.. </div></div>

These things move things? What have your dust particles moved? Or are you saying the dust itself moves? And what does any of this have to do with Jesus?

[BiggerStick47]

Also, you said there were no external light sources? You have glow sticks and a camera flash. Those are external light sources.

[Woods Walker]

The only Angel I see is your niece /images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

[Woods Walker]

I once dated an Irish woman. Her whole family believed in ghosts etc. They had an old house from the 1700's. This picture kept falling and the blame would was placed upon the "ghost". I explained that the supernatural should be the last explanation after all others have been exhausted rather than the first without even considering all others. But I made it clear that nothing is off the books as who knows? Been wrong before and often never more wrong than when I was 100% certain of being right.


Post edit

Fair enough. /images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

[BiggerStick47]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Woods Walker</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Come on man no reason to be so harsh. </div></div>

You're right. I edited my post.

[oldschool]

these are not dust particles I know you guys are all looking for some rational reason to explain things you cant! first I will say I believe in god (jesus christ) I have seen them break the air kind of like mirage its hard to explain. my first post says do you believe in jesus I didnt say this was jesus. let me tell you alittle about my self my brother is a pentocastal minister my father also was a minister he has passed since.. I my self believe in jesus and draw from his forgiveness daily but my understanding of things is a bit diffrent than the average person..

[oldschool]

have any of you ever seen these before? have any of you ever experienced something electrical or do any of you know anything of the afterlife.. my frst question was do you believe in jesus? my answer is yes he is my strength and understanding my patience my humility! god bless you all I was mearly looking for understanding for something that cant be explained yet!!

[oldschool]

ok If some of you believe these things are dust particles can you duplicate my picture? and in my picture some of these so called dust particles are 25 feet away. I would say thats a pretty good camera if I can take a picture of a dust particle thats 25 feet away..

[oldschool]

here is another pic that was taken 10-15 seconds later http://i206.photobucket.com/albums/bb100/oldschool13/home016.jpg

[oldschool]

oh and by the way my camera is an olympus 2.5x digital zoom 3.2 mega pixel camera.. something I bought to help me take pictures of things I was wanting to put on ebay..

[BiggerStick47]

How can you possibly judge the distance of these "orbs"? How do you know they are 25 ft away? Sorry man, but that is just dust.

[Ksnake]

If you can believe in Jesus, why do you have trouble believing in dust?

[Woods Walker]

"ok If some of you believe these things are dust particles can you duplicate my picture?"

Yes I can. Think what you are seeing is a camera ghost created with reflected light. Often particals reflect light and creates all sorta stuff. Look at this photo taken with a digital camera. The snow is very light but looks like orbs. Infact some Identical to yours
http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/ecr1.jpg

Here is a photo of yet more orbs. The snow was beyond light. In fact I could not even feel or hardly see it. More like wind blown dust. This photo was taken with an 800 dollar digital camera. Guessing each situation (partical size and color, reflected light etc etc) will produce different effects but they are basically the same.

http://i113.photobucket.com/albums/n220/Daytraderwon/PULKTRIP3.jpg

On the issue of your impressions I don't think you are liar. Often memories of events are influenced but many factors. Even seeing the photo could influence what you believe happened. That is why a room full of people can see the same thing yet have different impressions of what happened. They are not liars and will swear to GOD that the events occurred a certain way which is of course impossible as each person reports something a bit different.

I think your niece moved some dust around by twisting that glow stick. The camera created the orbs using reflected light. Your impression of the events are honest but may have been effected or influenced by subsequent events. I don’t discount the supernatural but ALL natural explanations must be disqualified first.

[anthracitic]

It's quite a stretch to conclude that dust spots in a photograph are (in fact) the supernatural ...
BTW, Jesus is ALWAYS capitalized.
http://www.lacarte.org/health/chemtrails/orbs/

[Sawtooth]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">are these angels or ghosts or?? </div></div>

Just sitting here trying to make the connection between believing in Jesus (your thread title) and answering your question.

Are they angels or ghosts? I would have no way of knowing. If you believe they are, then that's what counts.

Do I believe in Jesus? Yes.

Do I think you photographed dust particles? Yes.

Does what I think really matter? No. /images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

[Ksnake]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: anthracitic</div><div class="ubbcode-body">BTW, Jesus is ALWAYS capitalized.
</div></div>

What's even more interesting is that the only letter this guy ever capitalized is "I"

[Ksnake]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: oldschool</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> my frst question was do you believe in jesus? my answer is yes ... my humility!</div></div>

Time to apply that one /images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

[idaho lad]

Often times what we believe to be the Para-normal is quite normal. Just because we see spots, doesn't mean it's a Lord Jesus manifestation.

Again. I am not a Christian. But if you want to see an manifestation of the Lord Jesus, you see it by Him (Jesus) living and working thru the body of Christ (His present children and followers). That is His present body.

BTW Anthracitic. Your very right about Jesus always being in an capital "J". Also when we reference Him with the word "Him", the "Him" also starts in a capital. Very excellent point Anthracitic.

[Sawtooth]

idaho,

For a non-Christian, you sure sound like one! /images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

Just funnin ya.

[Woods Walker]

We have shown what the orbs are dust though my posted photos and anthracitic fine link. However I think the guy believes what he posted.

There is more to the “hunted” story a few posts back. Kathy’s family would claim they felt a chill and “a force/peson/who knows” in the room before things would slide off the tables etc. Sometimes drinks would fly off the table or the infamous picture. They ask me to explain this as I told them to look for the natural explanations first. Oh I was called “closed mind” but my mind was open to anything not just the supernatural at the expense of everything else. I looked over the room with the "ghost". Than it came to me. The floor looked level but it was far from it. A trick of the eye due to the walls etc of this 1700's house. I put baseball on the same table with the falling photo. Well the ball rolled fast. In fact any vibrations etc would make things slide off. Funny as it really did appear level. I guess an optical illusion. When asked about the chill in the room before and after the "events" I explained that they are conditioned by movies etc to expect this so the mind fills in the gaps after a soda slides off the table for no good reason or at least it seemed that way. Personally after hearing the ghost stories if alone at night and my coffee flew off a seemingly flat surface I too would have felt a chill or GOD knows what else.

Finally I had to get a level to show just how far off the floor and tables were. Still I don't think my proof was good enough. Old school Irish family. Seemed their cultural expectations had pre disposed them to view the supernatural as the primary explanation for the unexplained. Funny how I was the "CLOSED MINDED" person yet I was open to ALL Possibilities not just one. But the point I am trying to get is that these people are intelligent rational people. They just interpreted what they saw with their own cultural expectations. They were not liars or crack pots.

I don’t think this guy was being disrespectful to anything or anyone let alone GOD for that mater. I don’t think he is making up anything that he remembers. I don’t think he is lacks humility etc etc etc. So he is wrong about the orbs. Big deal. Who here has not been wrong before.

[BiggerStick47]

I would hate to see his reaction to ball lightening or swamp gas.

[oldschool]

hello once again, all of you who have responded to this post. i meant no disrespect to any one let alone (GOD) here is my first expierence with (orbs) or your so called dust i was injured in 2001 and lost my job so i was stuck at home alot, me and my wife had to move due to my injury and lack of a job at the time.. at this knew place we begain hearing and fealing strange things in this knew house. we just passed it off on things we thought were explainable! such as we had just turned the light off in one room and coming back by that room we saw the light was on. ok we forgot to turn the light off! but when we started feeling like there was someone else in the house with us, we passed it off on emotional feelings that we had at the time.. i also thought maybe it was just me i thought i must be going crazy.. until one night things started moving such as blinds on a sliding glass door coming off the ground 4-5 feet of the ground & the sliding glass door was closed. i wasnt alone that time.. i dont expect any one to believe me nor do i care.. i know what they are i even video taped these wierd things by accident they give off an electric charge as they pass through you your hair all over your body stands up without emotion.. thank you for allowing me to share some of my expierences with you GOD bless you and good knight..

[anthracitic]

Oldschool, as you may know, Coast to Coast A.M. has on, on a regular basis, paranormal researchers as guests. Why not call in, tell your story, and see what they can make of your experiences.
You asked for opinions of the anomalies in your photograph. Several here offered proven, unbiased explanations of why dust spots appear as they do in digital photography.
I think most here will accept, on face value, that you've experienced possible paranormal activity.
I can't quite make out if you consider these occurrences as malevolent or benevolent.

[BiggerStick47]

Wow.

[Woods Walker]

Biggerstick

Yup wow.

“ok If some of you believe these things are dust particles can you duplicate my picture?”

Even after I provided the requested duplication it was simply not addressed. In many ways this like the un level table had to be overlooked. But I do think the guy is honest however The human mind does not enjoy things that conflict with it’s own reality like my photos. We all in our own way viewing the world though a filter. Stress is a factor in this too.

"i was injured in 2001 and lost my job so i was stuck at home alot, me and my wife had to move due to my injury and lack of a job at the time.. at this knew place we begain hearing and fealing strange things in this knew house"

Clearly being injured and out of work was stressfull for Oldschool and his wife. A move is a ton of stress too. So is seeing orbs on a digital photo near his niece when these could be ghosts rather than what they are. Dust or rather a collected image of refected photons aka light bouncing off the dust. Much like the after image of the glow stick in the first photo. You can see that too.

If the shape was something other than an Orb or rather spheres I would have looked more into this. I don't want to bore people with Physics 101 but anytime you see the shape of least Resistance you tend to be looking at the building blocks of the natural world rather than a force imposing it's own will. Heck tinny bubbles and massive stars can't overcome this but bactera can. Looks like these "Angels" or "ghosts" just can't pull off a trick that earthworms and horseflys seems to excel at. So if I was him based on that alone I would not much worry about it.


Oldschool

As for the question on the form "do you believe in jesus"?

Yes I do.

[anthracitic]

http://www.lessemf.com/ghost.html

[Woods Walker]

Bustin' ghosts makes me feel good............Who are you going to call.../images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ghostbusters

[idaho lad]

I wouldn't be friendly with any unfamiliar spirits or strage beings. Stay away from such things as communication with spirits and principalities and you will do yourself a big favor.

Get friendly with such strange spirits and your opening up a door to a world you don't want to live in. If you communicate with spirits and the unknown you'll be used and played like a coin and used like a vehicle.

Don't mess with this world.

[Woods Walker]

Well in the case of the photo it is hard to befriend dust. But beyond that from a religious standpoint evil has no power over anyone unless it is willingly accepted or so I am told. But unfortunately "Willingly accepted" has very little to due with truth in advertising. /images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/eek.gif

[idaho lad]

Yep, I'm talking about willingly inviting powers in and befriending them. Willingly is the world.

Sometimes our curiosity leads to a willingness to let something enter.

[Woods Walker]

These things should be avoided on ALL grounds. First off the true miracle in that photo is his niece. But rather than look on this with wonder and joy he is being distracted by of all things dust. But beyond that from a supernatural perspective it should be avoided doubly so.

This brings back an old collage memory. Some people I knew started to screw around with this board game. I don’t know how to spell the darn thing but we all know it. I told them there is no proof that these things are anything more than cardboard and plastic however they insisted that though this dead relatives were communicating. So I said ok. I will for the sake of argument accept what is being said but asked a very simple question. How in the heck do you know what you are communicating with? Well the response was. "They told us". Hummm What if "They lie".

From a religious standpoint it has been made very clear that such things are to be avoided. If I am to understand the reason it seems to make good sense from that perspective. Here is the mythology.

First comes the apparition or unexplained event. Could also be someone looking for something they don’t really want. This happens during times of stress or vulnerability. The flip side of what I said about stress bending someone’s view of the world. Whatever the vulnerability it is exploited. Next comes the curiosity for the unknown. After that though either intimidation or an even more insidious means such as gaining the persons trust these so called long lost relatives or Angels begin to influence the victim into their own downfall. As the story goes these forces are in fact minions of the devil. Soon the victim is doing all kinds of crazy stuff like cutting Faustian deals and not even realizing what is happening. In the end they lose everything and I mean EVERYTHING with little recourse or hope. After all what is this person to say? Hay I trusted the devil and can't believe he would lie or trick me. Hello....Old Scratch is often described by religion as the "Prince of lies". Bitching about getting tricked is a bit like complaining about falling for the latest scam from Nigeria. No one cares as you have been warned. According to the story these evil forces pray on original sin. Which is Pride or rather the root of all Sin. Though pride people feel they are just too smart to be tricked.

Well that is how I heard it growing up. Never seen any demons or ghosts and I don't expect too anytime soon. I Don’t know what light reflecting off dust partials creating an optical illusion that was reproduced on this very form has to do with any of this. In any case he would be better to brush these things off like a muddy boot.

Jesus is one of the best loads of you know what the powers that be have force fed us. Cool picture though oldschool.

Res.

[William Clunie]

Resistor,
If you went to a public school in the US, then you certainly had lots besides Jesus forced on you. Like evolution, the green movement, and diversity training.

No one forced me to come to my belief in Jesus. I believe in Jesus as my Saviour because of my faith and convictions. I have a peace in my heart knowing I have eternal life through Jesus, and pray that the thousands that have been mislead come to Him also.

Hope you see you all on the other side,

William Clunie

WC,

I'm extremely aware of what has been forced on me in public school and what is continually forced on us/me by secondary education and major media. Actually, the vast majority of 'alternative' media as well. We certainly have been sold a bill of goods, especially with history and science.

I have explored the Jesus myth as well and I just don't by it. Certainly not in the way it has been presented. I do however respect your right to a belief system that works for you.

Res.

[ISAIAH53]

Resistor, if you like to read, might I suggest "The Case for Christ," by Lee Strobel.

[William Clunie]

Resistor,
I started to take offense to you referring to my belief system as "a load of you know what." I don't think you really meant it that way. You don't normally post offensive remarks here. I think your post posed more of a question on your part. I would also suggest the book title offered above.

William Clunie

[Ksnake]

I think if Jesus believers feel they can pontificate at will, then it's only fair that the "load of you know what" believers be allowed to speak their mind too. Nothing personal, just different beliefs.

[damon]

“Man, you are one pathetic loser!....No offense.”
-Lloyd

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: William Clunie</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Resistor,
I started to take offense to you referring to my belief system as "a load of you know what." I don't think you really meant it that way. You don't normally post offensive remarks here. I think your post posed more of a question on your part. I would also suggest the book title offered above.

William Clunie </div></div>

William,

You are correct, didn't really mean it that way and I apologize. It was my way of saying i just don't believe in what I have seen on this subject.
Have not read but have thumbed through "The Case for Christ". So far have the same stance. Maybe a full read is in order but doubt it will change my perspective.

Res.

[Ksnake]

I doubt the Jews would change their perspective either.

[Woods Walker]

All that from light reflecting off dust partials producing an optical illusion. /images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/crazy.gif /images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/grin.gif

[jeriah]

Re: the title of the thread. I do not believe in the divinity of Jesus Christ; I believe that he was one of many militant Jewish religious leaders resisting Roman occupation of Judea. This is my belief, but then, I wasn't there, so I could be wrong. No offense intended, but you asked, so...there it is. (Unlike believers, I don't capitalize the word "he" when referring to Jesus, as I believe that, if real, he was merely human.)

I'm also rather skeptical about the idea of God to begin with, no offense intended to the believers here, but it's just not something that fits into my world view right now. I remain open to the possibility that I'm wrong, and regularly read things contrary to what I believe: C.S. Lewis's Mere Christianity was quite enjoyable and thought provoking, as well as the recent book The God Theory by I believe Bernard Haisch. I strongly recommend the latter book as an intellecutal challenge to both Christians (and members of other religions) as well as atheists/agnostics like myself.

Re: the picture. It looks like dust to me. I have an example of a similar situation that I'd like to share.

When I was approximately twelve years old, my mother called me into the bathroom to witness a miracle. (This isn't going where it sounds like, I swear.) I went in and she showed me vision of a brilliant, glowing cross, visible out the bathroom window. The cross was equal-armed, and flared at the edges, almost like a Maltese or Iron Cross. It was made of brilliant yellow-white light, and was not visible outside, nor through any other window in the house! My mother, although not entirely a Christian, is very spiritual, and was deeply moved by this experience. I, on the other hand, attributed the phenomenon to the fact that our bathroom window was "frosted" by being checkered with perpindicular grooves like a pineapple grenade, or the checkering on a gunstock. The light from the porch light on a mother-in-law unit in the backyard was being refracted by the checkered plastic of the window.

Years later, on a paranormal television show (Unsolved Mysteries or something like it), a woman testified to having had a vision of a glowing cross, seen at night, out the window of her trailer...the bathroom window, in fact.

[Woods Walker]

Jeriah.

Check back on this thread. I reproduced the effect by posting several photos. But the evidence was generally ignored by the person who believed in a supernatural answer. I also explained from both religious and secular view points that belief in spirits of the dead visiting the living is not all that healthy. From a Secular perspective the poster ignored the real wondrous thing in the photo. The little girl playing with a light stick rather the center of attention was simple dust. Imagine how many factors must have come together in the universe for that little girl on this little world going around what is admittedly a 3rd rate star to be playing with a light stick. From a religious perspective someone does not know what these spirits are. If evil one could bet they would lie for the purpose of taking the whole family down a very dark road. So from any viewpoint it is not healthy.

[jeriah]

Woods:

Yes, unfortunately, people are all to eager to cling to "evidence" which supports their existing beliefs, and all too reluctant to accept evidence which challenges them.

It's a basic human trait and a certain amount of it makes sense; otherwise we'd have to completely re-evaluate the entire world every time we saw something new!

But, in excess, it results in intellectual stubbornness and a refusal to say what, in my mind, are the smartest and most powerful words in the English language: "I was wrong."